Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): Oct. 20, 2010

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 18 Dec 2010 11:47

habal wrote:
CRamS wrote:Here is the 4-part interview that Arnab conducted with terrorist Mush

http://www.timesnow.tv/Excl-Pakistan-lo ... 360695.cms

http://www.timesnow.tv/Excl-Pakistan-lo ... 360696.cms

http://www.timesnow.tv/Excl-Pakistan-lo ... 360696.cms

http://www.timesnow.tv/Excl-Pakistan-lo ... 360696.cms

I recall some posters were saying that Arnab "tears" into Mush. I am sorry, I have to disagree. Mush got away with bold-faced lies, and Arnab couldn't nail him. The most blatant was his comparison of Bangladesh with Kashmir. Plus, even a kid would have laughed off Mush's claim that TSPA has nothoing to do with LET crossing the LOC and creating mayhem in the valley, according to the b$%^&rd Mush, its the "people of TSP". And Arnab couldn't summon the simple common sense to tell him that if there was no state support, the "people of TSP" would have been shot dead like flies by the Indian army. There were any number of retorts that could have nailed Mush. Finally, what was that sucking up to Mush about visiting India? Thoo. All in all, I thought Mush got the better of Arnab, and once again he pulled off that rope trick.
He can't 'nail him' or be seen to be 'nailing him'. He is a professional journalist and intends to take his career forward. If his seen to be nailing him, he won't get any more interviews.

At times, dignified silence and moving on is the best reponse. And to give credit to Arnab, he moved on from Mush's Bangladesh rope trick; there was no point engaging him on that. But he let him off easily on Kargil and Kashmir. Mush got away with his bold-faced lie that there is no TSP stagte support to the decades old mayhem in Kashmir. Couldn't Arnab have prepared with facts like arms caches, LOC firing etc. All he had to do was talk to an Indian army officer and he would have given him the precise modus operendi. On Mumbai, the wily Mush wiggled out with this "I haven't seen the evidence" crap, and so I think Arnab did the right thing by not pressing him further. But the last bit about wanting him to viisit India, and hoping that Mush would be proved wrong (i.e., Mush saying he would never come again after he was refused a visa), was way too much sucking up for my taste. Once again, a dignified thank you would have been good enough.

Vril · Post by **Vril** » 18 Dec 2010 13:54

CRS

respectfully disagreeing. i think arnab was laying mines and mushy was avoiding some and stepping on some. you should have seen the discomfort on mushy's face right from the beginning. arnab rubbed salt on his wounds by starting from visa denial and mushy was on back foot since then.kashmir and bangladesh are programmed into pakis microchips so even if you ask them how is your ammi, expect them to talk about kashmir mujahideen and bangla aggression by India and how their ammi is affected by it. so nothing given there. and i think asking to come again was pulling a deeper one on mushy as a parting shot.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 18 Dec 2010 16:27

Why can't somebody compile (using this Musharraf's response to Arnab's questions as a starting point) a list of such Pakistani points of view and prepare an effective counter that we can use as a template to counter Pakistani propaganda and possibly even circulate to our media persons ?I am willing to help if somebody can take the lead.

JE Menon · Post by **JE Menon** » 18 Dec 2010 17:22

Arnab seemed a bit on the backfoot over the 1971 issue. He would have been much better equipped had there been a sort of Q&A on the issue ready to use, as it were...

Dilbu · Post by **Dilbu** » 18 Dec 2010 17:30

Pak rejects Bangladesh's demand for apology over troops' excesses in 1971 war

The Ministry of Foreign Affairs officials were again taken aback when the Bangladeshi side demanded the country's share of the four-billion-dollar worth of the pre-independence exchange, bank credit, and movable assets, which (according to the Bangladeshi side) were deposited or protected in West Pakistan during the 1971 war.

In addition to that, the visitors told the Pakistani side that Bangladesh also wanted the settlement of 200 million dollars, which Pakistan received from the international community as donation for the 1970 cyclone victims of the then East Pakistan.

However, Pakistan Foreign Secretary Salman Bashir politely turned down their demand for an apology, and made it clear to them that Pakistan was willing to enhance bilateral ties with Bangladesh, and suggested them to move ahead by burying the past.

"We should explore the opportunities to enhance trade and bilateral ties rather than living in the past," Bashir said.

Even Bangladeshis are more straight forward and aggressive when it comes to TSP than GOI.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 18 Dec 2010 17:35

For what Pakistan did in Bangladesh, the Bangladeshis should be ripping Pakistan's heart out and giving them hell!

How are enhanced bilateral ties between Bangladesh and a kabarhi ka failed state Pakistan going to be of any use to Bangladesh?!

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 18 Dec 2010 17:35

US won't object to N-deal between Pakistan and China: US envoy

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/worl ... 123471.cms

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 18 Dec 2010 17:38

Pakistani official praised Indian response on Mumbai attacks: WikiLeaks

http://www.dawn.com/2010/12/18/pakistan ... leaks.html

According to the Pakistan officer, the negative effects of the Mumbai attacks on ties between the two countries, who have fought three wars, would “fizzle out over the next few months”, the cable said.

anchal · Post by **anchal** » 18 Dec 2010 18:06

^ Both Pakistani and the US officialdom knows the Indian establishment pretty well. If BRF with only access to public info can so well predict babus, it should not be tough for Pakis with moles, supporters and sypathisers at every level including the dynasty.

krishnan · Post by **krishnan** » 18 Dec 2010 19:39

http://www.sify.com/news/us-drone-strik ... ag=Topnews

Islamabad: At least 51 suspected militants were killed in three US drone strikes in northwestern Pakistan's Khyber Pakhtunkhwa province, a media report said Saturday.

Gus · Post by **Gus** » 18 Dec 2010 20:16

How active is LeT in afg? We don't hear that many drone strikes taking out lashkar operatives.

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 18 Dec 2010 20:53

Dilbu wrote:Pak rejects Bangladesh's demand for apology over troops' excesses in 1971 war
The Ministry of Foreign Affairs officials were again taken aback when the Bangladeshi side demanded the country's share of the four-billion-dollar worth of the pre-independence exchange, bank credit, and movable assets, which (according to the Bangladeshi side) were deposited or protected in West Pakistan during the 1971 war.

In addition to that, the visitors told the Pakistani side that Bangladesh also wanted the settlement of 200 million dollars, which Pakistan received from the international community as donation for the 1970 cyclone victims of the then East Pakistan.

However, Pakistan Foreign Secretary Salman Bashir politely turned down their demand for an apology, and made it clear to them that Pakistan was willing to enhance bilateral ties with Bangladesh, and suggested them to move ahead by burying the past.

"We should explore the opportunities to enhance trade and bilateral ties rather than living in the past," Bashir said.
Even Bangladeshis are more straight forward and aggressive when it comes to TSP than GOI.

But refusing to give apologies is refusing to move on from the past - isnt it?

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 18 Dec 2010 21:33

CRamS wrote:I recall some posters were saying that Arnab "tears" into Mush. I am sorry, I have to disagree. Mush got away with bold-faced lies, and Arnab couldn't nail him. The most blatant was his comparison of Bangladesh with Kashmir. Plus, even a kid would have laughed off Mush's claim that TSPA has nothoing to do with LET crossing the LOC and creating mayhem in the valley, according to the b$%^&rd Mush, its the "people of TSP". And Arnab couldn't summon the simple common sense to tell him that if there was no state support, the "people of TSP" would have been shot dead like flies by the Indian army. There were any number of retorts that could have nailed Mush. Finally, what was that sucking up to Mush about visiting India? Thoo. All in all, I thought Mush got the better of Arnab, and once again he pulled off that rope trick.

++1

Moreover Arnab offered Musharraf a forum to make Kashmir the root cause of all the issues, which is pure 24K BS.

He could have pointed Paki commissioner meeting Hurriyat leaders and so on. But looks like he doesn't know a thing other than reading from his prescripted question paper.

Vivek K · Post by **Vivek K** » 18 Dec 2010 22:00

Pukis keep repeating the same theme - lets bury the past (without burying their terrorist ways)! Being a Pakistani citizen must be a great shame!

RamaY · Post by **RamaY** » 18 Dec 2010 22:07

I like the idea of preparing a set of questions and answers for Paki as well as DDM lies. Perhaps some smart journalists can learn how to plant IEDs properly.

jamwal · Post by **jamwal** » 18 Dec 2010 22:10

SSridhar jii,
What exactly do you have in mind ?

pgbhat · Post by **pgbhat** » 18 Dec 2010 22:14

Kayani and his Generals.

Significantly, the two politically important Corps Commands of Rawalpindi and Lahore have gone to Baluch Regiment officers, Lt Generals Khalid Nawaz Khan and Rashad Mehmood respectively, who could be expected to have ‘arm’ loyalty towards their chief. Like every other army chief before him, Kayani is proving no exception to the convention of favouring officers of his parent ‘arm,’ the Baloch regiment.

An important slot of GoC, Strategic Forces Command is held by an Artillery officer, Lt Gen Jamil Haider. Another is that of the GoC, Special Services Group, Cherat, now held by Maj Gen Farukh Bashir (Infantry) while the two operative assignments at the Special Project Directorate, Chaklala (in charge of nuclear stockpiles) — DG,Operations & Plans and DG-Security — have gone to Maj Gen Ausaf Ali of Engineers and Maj Gen Mohd Tahir Ashraf Khan (Infantry) respectively. A clansman, Maj Gen Naushad Ahmed Kayani (Infantry) appears to have been favoured as the new Director General, Military Intelligence.

After Kayani retires, the following Generals will be senior most — Lt Gen Asif Yasin Malik, currently XI Corps Commander, Peshawar, whose retirement date is March 31, 2014.Much would depend on how he handles the war against terror in FATA and what the Americans think of him.After him are the April 2014 retirees — Lt.Gen Waheed Arshad (Armoured Corps) who is highly rated and presently holding the crucial Chief of General Staff slot, and the Corps Commander, Lahore, Lt Gen Rashad Mehmood. Lahore has had a jinx associated with it as no Corps Commander from there has made it as Chief so far!

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 18 Dec 2010 23:02

WRT the Arnab Goswami's interview with Musharraf.

Think of what effect this would have on the mango individuals in India.
The media usually would report that mushy denies that the Pakistani army was involved in Kargil. But now people can actually see musharraf with his face clearly showing he is lying.
It was wonderful prime time entertainment to see the two faced liar squirming as he lied further and was held to account for all the evil that he has perpertrated.

Point to note is that only an Indian can do this to a pakistani dictator, no western media honcho can do this. The western media are simply not well informed enough or have an understanding of the pakistani psyche or character as we do.

I doubt that another media personality could debrief mushy more comprehensively with the possible exception of Karan Thapar.

JMT

putnanja · Post by **putnanja** » 18 Dec 2010 23:09

Gagan wrote:I doubt that another media personality could debrief mushy more comprehensively with the possible exception of Karan Thapar.

KT can, but won't. He has his own agenda unfortunately.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 18 Dec 2010 23:14

SSridhar wrote:Why can't somebody compile (using this Musharraf's response to Arnab's questions as a starting point) a list of such Pakistani points of view and prepare an effective counter that we can use as a template to counter Pakistani propaganda and possibly even circulate to our media persons ?I am willing to help if somebody can take the lead.

Good idea,and probably needed so that the Arnabs don't cut such a sorry spectacle and make a fool of India, but at the end of the day, in the absence of any muscle or punch from India, TSP will stick to its guns. And besides, TSP itself has so many supporters in India, just witness the recent circus on "Hindu terror". Bottom line is that anybody can do an equal equal like TSP does. India is not going to win the verbal tug of war with TSP given current realities on the ground. The deck is heavily stacked against India, most of all, Indians themselves are in total disarray. As Narendra ModiJi was lamenting, with TSP so neck deep in terror, it still enjoys the patronage of the big powers (although I wouldn't place the blame entirely on Rahul Baba as he does), and unless India bites TSP back, and does a real equal equal, words alone are not the solution. Short of that ignore TSP to the best we can is the best policy. Thats why I found Arnab sucking up to Mush about visiting India was disgusting.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 18 Dec 2010 23:17

Mushy has this problem with his incontinence - his verbal diarrhoea. Even as he lies most of the time and says 400% true in the same breath, he digs more and more graves for himself as he goes along.

Typical paki general, with a missing frontal lobe in his brain - thinks at a spinal level and knee jerkish to the extreme. Extremely myopic in his goals except when duly advised by individuals of higher intellect.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 18 Dec 2010 23:28

Gagan wrote: The western media are simply not well informed enough or have an understanding of the pakistani psyche or character as we do.

They are when it comes to their interests. Can TSP brazenly deny that Talibunnies are hiding in the tribal areas? Of course, unlike India, US is a supremely united and nationalist country. So all the media honchos will be well prepared with talking points prepared by whoever is the latest 1000-star general and his side-kicks. Plus, a honcho like late Holbrooke will give them a nice canned version of history that suits whatever US is doing at the moment. So the media celebrities in suit, boot, and with lots of theater will repeat the talking points. So, on TSP, they will aggressively question TSP, and true to form, as the 1000-star general told them, they will also repeat that the reason why TSP supports Talibunnies and other terrorists is because India is soooooo baaaaad that poor TSP needs terrorists to take on India. This is how US as a whole articulates its stand. But I repeat once again, this is only possible because of the overall strength and might of US power. Otherwise such nonsense can be laughed off. To this end, I do understand Arnab's limitation, but its preciely because the deck is stacked against you, that more creativity is needed, and Arnab failed on that count.

I doubt that another media personality could debrief mushy more comprehensively with the possible exception of Karan Thapar.

KT has his own agenda. More likely, KT will be so aggressive, will be so maacho, that he will take on "Hindu terror", and given a Mush a platform to aver that but for "Hindu terror", "South Asia" will be a garden of Eden. With pukes like KT, one doesn't TSP as enemies.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 18 Dec 2010 23:37

There is an undercurrent I think from the government itself to not paint TSP in too bad a light in the media. If the bigotry and sheer evil of what the Pakistanis have been upto all these years comes out in the open, destroying Pakistan will become a political issue with the public, and that will cause any GoI too much takleef.

Which is why media is kept at a DDM level.

It is a different matter altogether that the current dispensation has a certain viewpoint and certain political compulsions in painting the BJP and the hindutva brigade in an exceptionally negative light.

WRT Pakistan, if the wikileaks documents are anything to go by, the GoI babus understand the problem very well, AND they have access to intel from within pakistan (which we at BRF lack many a times - we can only know what gurus here analyze for us).

brihaspati · Post by **brihaspati** » 18 Dec 2010 23:45

X-posting : seeking info

Do we have any up to date information about "Enemy property acts" within Pak, and various land-grab schemes carried out by Pakis on lands of non-Muslims and those who fled Pak or were forced to flee Pak? The issue is still alive in BD. There is a very large number of voices now shouting about Israeli land-grab in Palestine. A collelction of info on such grabs by the Islamists wherever they have come to dominate will be useful. Any legislative justifications given by the "international community" (in this case the pro-Islamic European voices) for any moves on Palestine will automatically be a pointer for use on Pakistan too.

Venkarl · Post by **Venkarl** » 19 Dec 2010 00:07

SSridhar wrote:
krithivas wrote:Honest question - What are female suicide bombers entitled to - Hourons?
Krithivas, an honest answer. She gets *nothing*.

what? no 72..oops? ...ok I'll shut my mouth.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 19 Dec 2010 00:15

Venkarl wrote:"SSridhar"]
krithivas wrote:Honest question - What are female suicide bombers entitled to - Hourons?
Krithivas, an honest answer. She gets *nothing*.
what? no 72..oops? ...ok I'll shut my mouth.

Kaffir, the reward is its the enjoyment of 69 in eternity. It is called the punishment for kuffar and reward for duffar.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 19 Dec 2010 00:22

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/cricke ... China.html
Pakistan to play 'home' games in China

Touring sides have steered clear of playing in Pakistan since the attack last year on the Sri Lankan team bus in Lahore, which killed six police officers and a driver. Six cricketers and a coach were also among the injured. Since then Pakistan has played "home" tests against Australia in England, and against South Africa in deserted stadiums in the United Arab Emirates. Now – risking inevitable jibes about getting out for a Peking Duck – Pakistan is looking to China to host matches, even though it languishes below such cricketing powerhouses as Iran and the Maldives in world rankings. Javed Miandad, a former Pakistan captain who holds the position of cricket ambassador to China, has submitted a report to the Pakistan Cricket Board setting out the case for playing in China. At a time when cricket playing nations are reluctant to visit Pakistan, I think China is another option for us to arrange our home series at that neutral venue," he said.

( In time of Distress, Pakistani are taking refuge in China. The Land of Pures with national motto of Pakistan ka matlab la ilah illiha has taken a kaffir Mulak as main Auliya. this calls for new motto to be ' Pakistan ka matlab Kya Hai , Na deen,Na Iman But Insult to Allah )

abhik · Post by **abhik** » 19 Dec 2010 00:24

SSridhar wrote:Why can't somebody compile (using this Musharraf's response to Arnab's questions as a starting point) a list of such Pakistani points of view and prepare an effective counter that we can use as a template to counter Pakistani propaganda and possibly even circulate to our media persons ?I am willing to help if somebody can take the lead.

I have observed that often in pak related discussions and debates on tv (mainly English) the non WKK views are represented by complete idiots(like that young guy from Shiv Sena) who cant retort to even the most common cliche and even smarter non-WKK panelists fail to hit the nail on the head and get side tracked. I thought we should make a repository of standard responses to the most common BS that Pakis or WKKs make. Nothing elaborate or going deeply into history etc. , just pointing out the fallacies in their logic and using commonly accepted facts. Call it countering paki propagandu 101. I'll set the ball rolling with the following :-
1> this is a favorite amongst those in or associated with the paki government and the aman ki asha types on the topic of resumption of composite dialog -

By not talking the only people we are helping are the terrorists

retort: Who are you(or the Pakistanis) helping by not taking action against the Terrorists?
The hotter head ones like Mushy will probably start frothing in the mouth and the smarter ones will try and deflect or change the subject, but if you keep at it eventually perfidy will be clear to even the most casual viewer or the undecided mind.

RajeshA · Post by **RajeshA** » 19 Dec 2010 00:31

Please make use of the Counter Propaganda Thread. It is meant exactly for such endeavors.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 19 Dec 2010 04:03

6 month old video:

Sawaal: Is India sponsoring terrorism in Pakistan?
Pervez Hoodbhoy lets loose.
Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QdQvT_cp ... re=related
Part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oH1vt3xl ... re=related

shynee · Post by **shynee** » 19 Dec 2010 06:51

Found this on Military Photos

Pakistan tests first locally-built helicopter

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwCapCpD ... r_embedded

Rajdeep · Post by **Rajdeep** » 19 Dec 2010 09:45

Not a great way to start the day by looking at a pic of Jabba the Poak

Here is the article along with it , usual khanjar in the musharraf behavior from the poaks
Pakistani Spy Agency Denies It Unmasked CIA Chief

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/12/1 ... 98606.html

An official with Pakistan's Inter-Services Intelligence agency, its lead spy agency and a powerful force in the country, said Saturday any suggestions it outed the station chief were "a slur."

In particular, he denied the notion that the U.S. lawsuits had spurred the ISI to retaliate.

Such "unfounded stories can create differences between the two organizations," the official said, speaking on condition of anonymity because he is not cleared to brief the media.

The lawsuits in NY need to be followed and if possible be helped by GOI. But somehow I feel it will not happen.

"We are in the process of serving all defendants," James Kreindler, an attorney representing the plaintiffs, wrote in an e-mail. "Most have been served, which triggers their obligation to answer."

Suraj · Post by **Suraj** » 19 Dec 2010 09:57

shynee wrote:Found this on Military Photos

Pakistan tests first locally-built helicopter

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwCapCpD ... r_embedded

That's not a helicopter but an autogyro. Looks like a standard kit model with indigenous green paint.

ajit_tr · Post by **ajit_tr** » 19 Dec 2010 10:04

obama redux in pakistani NA .wen addressin pak NA today.it wasnt in wens's program list i think changes were made at 11th hour.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 19 Dec 2010 10:10

Rajdeep wrote: The lawsuits in NY need to be followed and if possible be helped by GOI. But somehow I feel it will not happen.

The current GOI has more important priorities that "threaten" the integrity & security of the nation, i.e., bringing the underground "Hindu terrorists" to justice. Pin-pricks like Mumbai? They can be absorbed by the 1000s.

CRamS · Post by **CRamS** » 19 Dec 2010 11:50

I am sure Rahul babu will ascribe to this equal equal from terror headquarters.

ArmenT · Post by **ArmenT** » 19 Dec 2010 11:56

shynee wrote:Found this on Military Photos

Pakistan tests first locally-built helicopter

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwCapCpD ... r_embedded

That's an autogyro, not a helicopter. Also notice that in the video clip, the wheels don't all leave the ground. Perhaps the pilot lost his nerve and didn't want to lift off? My bet is that this is going to be the flying equivalent of the infamous Habib Sitara.

disha · Post by **disha** » 19 Dec 2010 12:11

shynee wrote:Found this on Military Photos

Pakistan tests first locally-built helicopter

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwCapCpD ... r_embedded

It is their Light Combat Helicopter!

arun · Post by **arun** » 19 Dec 2010 12:25

^^^ A.Q. Khan must have clandestinely photocopied the designs of “Little Nellie” on the sets of "You Only Live Twice"

:

Clicky

abhishek_sharma · Post by **abhishek_sharma** » 19 Dec 2010 12:39

Richard Holbrooke, Thirsting for a Role in History

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/19/weeki ... burns.html