Should we discontinue EVMs?

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Rahul Mehta » 07 Dec 2010 11:58

Bihar: Congress for Probe into 'Tampering' of EVMs

Bihar state Congress today said the Election Commission should order a high-level inquiry into the complaints of tampering and hacking of Electronic Voting Machines (EVMs) in the just-concluded assembly elections in the state. "A high-level inquiry into the complaints of tampering and hacking of EVMs by a team comprising officials of the Commission and IT experts should be conducted at the earliest," party's media cell Chairman Prem Chandra Mishra said here. He, however, said his intention was not not to raise a question mark on the EC, but if there was any doubt among the masses, it should be addressed. Mishra said several of his party nominees had lodged such complaints.


Muppalla wrote: I ask the members to read my post above again and again. The fight is now in the enemy's land. Let us see whether the government puts an end or will just go ahead with the same game. For future of INC EVMs are the central strategy. However, the problems is other also may have got handle now. The biggest ones may be who has handle on them are out of congress in AP.


(CIA = CIA + MNCs + USG + Christianists)

EVM is CIA strategy, not a Congress strategy. Rajmata, retarded Prince, spineless MMS et al have no strength to pull this scam, and do not have control over media to suppress the news spread. Consider the the fact that NO TV channel showed HVKP's video except TV9-Telugu. Congress doesnt control media-owners to these level - only MNCs do. MNCs told mediamen not to show the video and so MNCs did not show that video.

MNCs saw that making Congress win in Bihar was not possible, as that would need EVMs to add some 25% votes to Congress and that would expose EVM-rigging. So next best option was Nitish as Nitish has supported MNCs as well as supported extending reservation to Dalit converts. Also, projecting MNC-agent Nitish as viable PM candidate has plus point - it cuts the image monopoly NaMo had as non-Congress Pm candidate. So CIA rigged EVMs in favor of Nitish, and MNCs' puppet mediamen projected Nitish as winner so that there are no surprises.

The complaint of Bihar unit will have no impact as Sonia cant dare to defy MNCs and ask for paper ballots.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby ramana » 08 Dec 2010 03:45

Hindu reports:

Report on missing EVMS sent to CEC


-------
Theft exposes lapses in security provided at EVM storage godowns

Stolen EVMs not part of units used for last Assembly and LS elections

-------------------
HYDERABAD: The Chief Electoral Officer Bhanwar Lal sent a detailed report on Monday night about the missing Electronic Voting Machines from a godown in Vijayawada to Central Election Commission which took a serious note of the incident and sought a report.

He deputed the Additional CEO Dakshinamurthy to Vijayawada on Sunday to ascertain facts about the incident. The reports about the theft of EVMs in Krishna district created a furore and raised concern as the stolen EVMs could have contained crucial polling data. The theft, importantly, exposed the lapses in security provided at EVM storage godowns. Interestingly, the EC gave instructions in the month of May itself for providing round-the-clock police security near the godowns where EVMs were stored. However the godown at Vijayawada had no security guards. Mr. Bhanwar Lal told The Hindu that fortunately the stolen EVMs were not part of units used for last Assembly and Parliament elections. The units employed in the last elections in Krishna district were safe in a godown at Machilipatnam and they were all intact. The stolen 25 EVMs — 15 controlling units and 10 ballot units stolen by ragpickers were part of 9,000 units stored in a godown at Vijayawada under the purview of RDO. While police recovered six ballot units, the other missing units were turned into scrap. The incident came to light after an EVM case was found lying outside the godown by an employee at Sub-Collector's office. Mr.Banwar Lal said that the police arrested the rag-pickers and the scrap dealer. “It is a case of theft with no malafide intent. However EVMs from the unsafe godown were shifted to a new go-down and guards were posted,” he said.

Asked what action would be initiated against officials concerned for the lapse, he said “EC will decide about it. We submitted the report,”

Meanwhile, alerted by the theft, the CEO instructed all the District Collectors to inspect the condition of go-downs, discard those not feasible and physically take a tally of the EVMs and submit a report within two days.


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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Yagnasri » 08 Dec 2010 06:22

As per the EC this inspection of EVM's is ot be done in the presence of the political leaders. But it is never being done. EC it self is telling lies even to Supreme Court.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Muppalla » 09 Dec 2010 08:13

I don't go into CIA etc. But I take what Shri Hariprasad has demonstrated. It is now booth capturing style. So I beleive BJP has got handle and hence the Bihar results. However, as I wrote earlier BJP is playing smart by only rigging extremely visible constituencies where it is obvious and any one will suspect. Instead of shouting over the roof about EVMs, just do this so that something by someone will be done before a big election.

BPCC collects affidavits to prove polls were rigged

PATNA: The Bihar Pradesh Congress Committee (BPCC) has collected 600 affidavits from voters, who had not voted for the BJP or JD(U) yet their votes were counted during the last assembly elections. The BPCC charged that there were malpractices on a large scale during the voting otherwise the NDA would not have secured such a massive mandate.

As a test case, the BPCC has collected affidavits FROM voters of four constituencies viz: Lalganj, Barbigha, Benipatti and Alinagar. It is also planning to take up the matter on a larger scale and cover around 50-55 constituencies.

Confirming this, BPCC spokesman Premchand Mishra said that the party got suspicious when they detected after the counting of votes that Muslims voted for the BJP and EVMs registering votes in favour of the JD(U) candidates in an area known as stronghold of Yadavs. Mishra said that these two patterns of voting were not only impossible, but also deceptive and suspicious given the political situation prevailing at that time as the Muslims were utterly against the BJP while Yadavs were wholeheartedly united in favour of RJD chief Lalu Prasad.

The voters, Mishra said, have filed affidavit in their respective areas saying that they have not voted yet their votes have been counted. This could not have been possible without the connivance of district administration.

He said the NDA had not expected, at any cost, that it would garner so much of votes and secure win of its 206 candidates. It was not possible even during 1977 when there was an anti-Congress wave in the country. And this time there was no NDA wave. "I can't think even in wildest imagination that bicycles and uniform for girls would do such a miracle. In fact, it was administration's miracle," Mishra said.

The BPCC spokesman declared, "First we would lodge a formal complaint with the Election Commission informing it about the wrongdoings during the voting and request it to get the matter examined by any IT experts. If the EC doesn't act on our request, we would move the court with full facts."


We have to see if this becomes louder and the UPA government or EC may have to finally do something.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Muppalla » 09 Dec 2010 08:20

ramana wrote:
Report on missing EVMS sent to CEC

-------
Theft exposes lapses in security provided at EVM storage godowns

Stolen EVMs not part of units used for last Assembly and LS elections

-------------------
HYDERABAD: The Chief Electoral Officer Bhanwar Lal sent a detailed report on Monday night about the missing Electronic Voting Machines from a godown in Vijayawada to Central Election Commission which took a serious note of the incident and sought a report.

He deputed the Additional CEO Dakshinamurthy to Vijayawada on Sunday to ascertain facts about the incident. The reports about the theft of EVMs in Krishna district created a furore and raised concern as the stolen EVMs could have contained crucial polling data. The theft, importantly, exposed the lapses in security provided at EVM storage godowns. Interestingly, the EC gave instructions in the month of May itself for providing round-the-clock police security near the godowns where EVMs were stored. However the godown at Vijayawada had no security guards. Mr. Bhanwar Lal told The Hindu that fortunately the stolen EVMs were not part of units used for last Assembly and Parliament elections. The units employed in the last elections in Krishna district were safe in a godown at Machilipatnam and they were all intact. The stolen 25 EVMs — 15 controlling units and 10 ballot units stolen by ragpickers were part of 9,000 units stored in a godown at Vijayawada under the purview of RDO. While police recovered six ballot units, the other missing units were turned into scrap. The incident came to light after an EVM case was found lying outside the godown by an employee at Sub-Collector's office. Mr.Banwar Lal said that the police arrested the rag-pickers and the scrap dealer. “It is a case of theft with no malafide intent. However EVMs from the unsafe godown were shifted to a new go-down and guards were posted,” he said.

Asked what action would be initiated against officials concerned for the lapse, he said “EC will decide about it. We submitted the report,”

Meanwhile, alerted by the theft, the CEO instructed all the District Collectors to inspect the condition of go-downs, discard those not feasible and physically take a tally of the EVMs and submit a report within two days.



Did this not ring bell for anyone?

Truely India is ruled by Mafia. The gang leaders are the 2G at the center and YSR at AP. The art of EVM tampering was born in AP. Period. The YSR mafia led by Jagan, Lagadapati Rajgopal mastered it for 2009 elections. Lagadapati was supposed to lose Vijayawada LS seat but won by 5000 votes. His company is also one of the several vendors of EVM servicing. The stolen ones are also from Vijayawada.

What rings me is that as Jagan is out the EVM rigging will be wide open to several players for the next elections. You either close the loopholes or face the unpredictability.

If my assumption that BJP got a handle then the possibilites are several.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Rahul Mehta » 09 Dec 2010 08:28

Muppalla wrote:I don't go into CIA etc


Ok. But if CIA didnt rig EVMs, then it proves no one did. Because no one except CIA (CIA = CIA + MNCs + Christianists + USG) has strength to ensure that TV channels wont show 10 minute video on how EVMs can be rigged with ease. Try to answer - who suppressed this video from coming on TV channels?

So I beleive BJP has got handle and hence the Bihar results. However, as I wrote earlier BJP is playing smart by only rigging extremely visible constituencies where it is obvious and any one will suspect. Instead of shouting over the roof about EVMs, just do this so that something by someone will be done before a big election.


These EVMs are stored by District Collectors and are owned by EC. EC can demand CBI inquiry against Collectors who assist BJP in rigging elections. And EC is under Congress (or CIA), not under BJP. So Collectors will not assist BJP in rigging elections. I will rule out rigging by BJP or for that matter Congress as well.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Sachin » 09 Dec 2010 12:34

Rahul Mehta wrote:These EVMs are stored by District Collectors and are owned by EC. EC can demand CBI inquiry against Collectors who assist BJP in rigging elections. And EC is under Congress (or CIA), not under BJP. So Collectors will not assist BJP in rigging elections. I will rule out rigging by BJP or for that matter Congress as well.

This is over-simplifying things. As per this statement it is as if the entire bureaucratic machinery (including Civil Service officers assigned to a state cadre) all owe their loyalty to the Congress regime at the Centre. Do you think the entire civil bureaurcracy in the nation takes orders from Sonia Gandhi and Co.? EC will not demand any enquiry against BJP or any District Collector. Because it only exposes the malpractises related to EVM even more. Congress and BJP have complained about EVM tampering. So how come the Congress stopped their whining and asked EC to order an enquiry? As per your statement any ways the EC is a chamcha of Congress.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Rahul Mehta » 09 Dec 2010 20:23

Rahul Mehta wrote:These EVMs are stored by District Collectors and are owned by EC. EC can demand CBI inquiry against Collectors who assist BJP in rigging elections. And EC is under Congress (or CIA), not under BJP. So Collectors will not assist BJP in rigging elections. I will rule out rigging by BJP or for that matter Congress as well.


Sachin wrote: This is over-simplifying things. As per this statement it is as if the entire bureaucratic machinery (including Civil Service officers assigned to a state cadre) all owe their loyalty to the Congress regime at the Centre. Do you think the entire civil bureaurcracy in the nation takes orders from Sonia Gandhi and Co.?


No. The elite Civil Officers take orders from MNCs via Sonia/MMS. I cant elaborate as I have been banned before for explaining how MNCs and MMS interact. But word on the street is that MMS is not PM, and viceroy of India.

EC will not demand any enquiry against BJP or any District Collector. Because it only exposes the malpractises related to EVM even more. Congress and BJP have complained about EVM tampering. So how come the Congress stopped their whining and asked EC to order an enquiry? As per your statement any ways the EC is a chamcha of Congress.


EC will not demand malpractice against DC if he manipulates EVMs to favor BJP, as that would expose EVMs. But EC an always use 10s of other excuses to harm DC. Even after election is over, center has 10s of ways to harass DC.

Only the local leaders in Congress\BJP have complained against EVMs. The seniors in all parties have supported EVMs. Thats because the locals are not under direct control of MNCs, and they are pressured by party activists to raise voice against EVMs. So they raise voice one day, and give up next day.

.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Sachin » 10 Dec 2010 10:14

Rahul Mehta wrote:No. The elite Civil Officers take orders from MNCs via Sonia/MMS.

I would be surprised if this is not known to the parties who are ruling the state. For example CPI(M) in Kerala. Do you think V.S Achu, Pinarayi Vijayan (the State Secretary) are idiots not to know that all their Chief Secretaries, DGPs etc. are hood-winking them and taking orders from MMS or Soniar (or the CIA, which CPI(M) consideres the arch-evil behind all their misfortunes). Same can be said about Karnataka Govt., Gujarath Govt. etc. To say that all elite (i.e high ranking) officers in civil machinery across the country takes orders from MMS and Sonia cabal is a bit preposturous is it not? :).

But EC an always use 10s of other excuses to harm DC. Even after election is over, center has 10s of ways to harass DC

Do we have any reports which indicate large scale punitive measures taken against DCs after the elections or in some near by time frame?

Only the local leaders in Congress\BJP have complained against EVMs. The seniors in all parties have supported EVMs.

Are you saying that the seniors of every single party in India are part of Sonia/MMS/CIA Cabal? In that case that is the biggest problem at hand, and replacing or fine tuning EVMs will not make any effect. The cabal can find new ways of vote tampering.

Dont tell me "right to recall" is the solution for this as well? :). Because an MNC who can bribe their way through 10 top level leaders can use them to bribe the way down as well. And whose bribe got the maximum number of supporters win (just like the case where any party who gets the maximum votes win).

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Rahul Mehta » 10 Dec 2010 11:43

Sachin wrote:I would be surprised if this is not known to the parties who are ruling the state. For example CPI(M) in Kerala. Do you think V.S Achu, Pinarayi Vijayan (the State Secretary) are idiots not to know that all their Chief Secretaries, DGPs etc. are hood-winking them and taking orders from MMS or Soniar (or the CIA, which CPI(M) consideres the arch-evil behind all their misfortunes). Same can be said about Karnataka Govt., Gujarath Govt. etc. To say that all elite (i.e high ranking) officers in civil machinery across the country takes orders from MMS and Sonia cabal is a bit preposturous is it not? :). .... Are you saying that the seniors of every single party in India are part of Sonia/MMS/CIA Cabal? In that case that is the biggest problem at hand, and replacing or fine tuning EVMs will not make any effect. The cabal can find new ways of vote tampering.


Seniors of most big parties, including CPM, are NOT part of MMS/Sonia cabal, but they now all report to MNCs or at least learn to look aside. Thats because of MNCs' control over TV channels. And yes, corruption problem is bigger than EVM rigging. But solution to both is one and same.

====

Dont tell me "right to recall" is the solution for this as well? :). Because an MNC who can bribe their way through 10 top level leaders can use them to bribe the way down as well. And whose bribe got the maximum number of supporters win (just like the case where any party who gets the maximum votes win).
[/quote]

MNCs havent bought top 10 levels. They have bought up top 5 levels in India, which is about 100000 people. Some top 1000 are bought up with active knowledge, where as rest 99000 are bought up via system rules set by the top 1000.

MNCs are cant bribe 75 crore voters. Thus, proposed procedure-draft of Right to Recall Election Commissioner is immune to MNC purchase. Can CIA rig proposed RTR-PM procedure? NO, as the proposed procedure-draft doesnt use EVM or even paper ballot. Please see proposed procedure-DRAFT to recall PM in section-6.6 of The Book aka http://rahulmehta.com/301.pdf . The proposed procedure for Right to Recall CEC is carbon copy. The proposed procedure is more reliable than existing banking systems' transaction and cant be rigged by any known technology. So yes, proposed RTR-draft is a solution. :)

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Muppalla » 13 Dec 2010 08:23

US prof behind EVM study deported on arrival

New Delhi : An American computer scientist, J Alex Halderman, who had co-authored a study titled “India’s EVMs are vulnerable to fraud”, was not allowed to enter the country after landing at the Indira Gandhi International (IGI) Airport here on Sunday evening. Airport sources said he would be deported, but offered no reason for the action.
Speaking to The Indian Express from the airport, Halderman said: “I am about to be thrown out of this country and there is no reason anyone is giving me. There is just no explanation, they are not letting me enter.”

Halderman, an assistant professor of electrical engineering and computer sciences at the University of Michigan, was here to attend a technical conference in Gujarat.

In February this year, top researchers from India, US and Netherlands, had come up with a study which said that EVMs are prone to tampering. Halderman and his Indian co-author, Hari K Prasad, were part of the group.

Earlier, the Election Commission had challenged Prasad to demonstrate how EVMs could be tampered with. The EC, however, withheld access to the EVMs.

In his blog about the study, Halderman wrote: “Despite widespread reports of election irregularities and suspicions of electronic fraud, the Election Commission has never permitted security researchers to complete an independent evaluation. Hari and others in India repeatedly offered to collaborate with the Election Commission to better understand the security of the machines, but they were not permitted to complete a serious review.”

He added: “Indian election authorities have repeatedly claimed that the machines are ‘tamperproof,’ but we demonstrated important vulnerabilities by studying a machine provided by an anonymous source. The story took a disturbing turn when my co-author, Hari Prasad, was arrested by Indian authorities demanding to know the identity of that source.”

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby habal » 13 Dec 2010 12:41

Sachin wrote:
Rahul Mehta wrote:No. The elite Civil Officers take orders from MNCs via Sonia/MMS.

I would be surprised if this is not known to the parties who are ruling the state. For example CPI(M) in Kerala. Do you think V.S Achu, Pinarayi Vijayan (the State Secretary) are idiots not to know that all their Chief Secretaries, DGPs etc. are hood-winking them and taking orders from MMS or Soniar (or the CIA, which CPI(M) consideres the arch-evil behind all their misfortunes). Same can be said about Karnataka Govt., Gujarath Govt. etc. To say that all elite (i.e high ranking) officers in civil machinery across the country takes orders from MMS and Sonia cabal is a bit preposturous is it not? :).



there is a saying 'Ambani controls all of them' . . which may or may not be true, but they are all sold anyways. CPI(M) in India works with the 'system'. Else they would need a revolution, which is when they could rule independently, but still beholden to the worldwide system.

One would normally think that if everything is hunky-dory, anyone who wants to inspect the EVMs can be allowed and even encouraged.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Pranav » 13 Dec 2010 12:58

Opinion polls should be banned: CEC Quraishi

http://www.expressindia.com/story_print ... yId=723704

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby ramana » 13 Dec 2010 22:31

Because they will reveal rigging, when the results show contrary to Opinion Polls?

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby ramana » 13 Dec 2010 22:33

BTW, Siliconeer, a lefty rag in Bay Area had small comment on "surprise" in Bihar. They said with 40% of the vote Nitesh Kumar got 80% of the seats and were astonished by that. Their expectation was that Bihar would be something else.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Pranav » 14 Dec 2010 11:42

Muppalla wrote:US prof behind EVM study deported on arrival

Halderman, an assistant professor of electrical engineering and computer sciences at the University of Michigan, was here to attend a technical conference in Gujarat.


What's up with this conference in Gujarat? Modi getting wise?

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Muppalla » 14 Dec 2010 19:25

Pranav wrote:
Muppalla wrote:US prof behind EVM study deported on arrival

Halderman, an assistant professor of electrical engineering and computer sciences at the University of Michigan, was here to attend a technical conference in Gujarat.


What's up with this conference in Gujarat? Modi getting wise?


Read my posts about Gujarat and Bihar polls above in this and previous pages. I am suspecting something is happening. As this is all tampering and not satellite based hacking :) , probably equalizer is being ordered across the political spectrum. In AP, the real master tamperers are out of INC, it will be very interesting for the deifinite-upcoming AP polls.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby vhkprasad » 15 Dec 2010 00:21

Pranav wrote:
Muppalla wrote:US prof behind EVM study deported on arrival

Halderman, an assistant professor of electrical engineering and computer sciences at the University of Michigan, was here to attend a technical conference in Gujarat.


What's up with this conference in Gujarat? Modi getting wise?


We have withdrawn from the conference as it was a condition that these guys cannot address a conference on a tourist Visa.. silly conditions..

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby paramu » 15 Dec 2010 01:13

Who are we? Are you Hari Prasad?

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby ramana » 15 Dec 2010 03:29

yeah. You can see from his name itself.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Dileep » 15 Dec 2010 07:49

Well, you should have anticipated the antagonism, and taken a business visa.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Pranav » 15 Dec 2010 08:02

vhkprasad wrote:We have withdrawn from the conference as it was a condition that these guys cannot address a conference on a tourist Visa.. silly conditions..


I am sure they can't stop people from getting together in a room and chatting ... call it a discussion rather than a conference.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Dileep » 15 Dec 2010 08:11

^^This is mera bharat mahan. If there is a woman in the room, they can put you in under immoral traffic act. If there is no woman, they can put you under homo act.

Waitaminit! Court ruled against that act. Let us see.... What about 'found under suspicious circumstances'?

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Rahul Mehta » 15 Dec 2010 08:13

Well, you should have anticipated the antagonism, and taken a business visa.


Yes. But a better step I suggest is that we should force PM to sign RTI2-GN-draft. Then using RTI2-GN, we should enact Right to Recall CEC, Narco Test in Public by Majority approval, Imprisonment by Majority approval and Execution by Majority approval. After that, we should using majority approval take Narco Tests of Chawala and Qureshi in public. Truth will come out and then we can imprison/execute the guilty using imprisonment by majority approvaland execution by majority approval procedures.

My point is - instead of asking girls to take precautions against rape, it is better to hit the rapist so hard that next wanna-be-rapist will deter.

===

HVKP,

Where is the conference? I am badly stuck with 4 Income Tax scrutinies and dont get time to even breath. I havent gone to work for 2 weeks. I am not sure I can attend. But might try.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Dileep » 15 Dec 2010 09:57

Image
I AM NOT TAKING THE BAIT

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby SaiK » 15 Dec 2010 11:33

Any electronic voting machine, imho, must use a 2 factor authentication, one being the photo id on the card, and either a retina / finger print.

In addition on the secure EVM reader for counting must have 3 factor authentication with dual password keepers, where a hair DNA sample can be used to match the officer who is in charge of counting process.

Furthermore, the counters must be a based write once counter and that can't be re programmed., and the machines must replace a write once flash chip every election.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby vhkprasad » 18 Dec 2010 22:55

Dileep wrote:Well, you should have anticipated the antagonism, and taken a business visa.


You are right and i suggested them, it is unfortunate that the organizers got approval from the ministry at the last moment and all the foreign speakers are advised to take tourist Visa. And the Ministry of Home applied visa rules only with my colleagues ignoring other participants. Well we were aware of the intentions behind and should have taken precautions but......it's ok we are all on real tourism now spending time in Indian jungles. Good Night Dileep

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby ramana » 19 Dec 2010 07:45

VHK, At a minumum hold a webinar and get it on youtube. That the message will still be there and hopefully spreads.

What do you think of the missing EVMS in Vijayawada? Why were they stored in un-secure conditions?

The conjecture is that they were some of the stock of EVMS used in AP and could be the tampered ones.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby RamaY » 24 Dec 2010 04:42

EC agrees to try EVMs with printers/receipts on a trial basis?

http://eenadu.net/story.asp?qry1=4&reccount=29

Virupaksha
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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Virupaksha » 24 Dec 2010 05:58

RamaY wrote:EC agrees to try EVMs with printers/receipts on a trial basis?

http://eenadu.net/story.asp?qry1=4&reccount=29

It says only the indersen committee has given approval on a trial basis. But I do not know it's executive powers, I think it has only recommendationary powers and the executive powers lie with the babus.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Rahul Mehta » 24 Dec 2010 07:06

RamaY wrote:EC agrees to try EVMs with printers/receipts on a trial basis?

http://eenadu.net/story.asp?qry1=4&reccount=29


NREGS for IT people.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby AjayKK » 12 Jan 2011 13:28

Quraishi hints at changes in EVMs

Chief Election Commissioner (CEC) S Y Quraishi on Tuesday indicated that electronic voting machines (EVMs) may undergo some changes and rectifications very soon.

“The current EVMs are doing fine. However, keeping in mind the complaints against the use of these machines, we have formed an expert committee to look into what changes and rectifications can be made in the machines. It (the committee) has already held discussions with various political parties on the issue and has taken their suggestions,” Quraishi said here.


From the above link, a curious fact emerges:

Quraishi strongly disapproved the “paid news” system adopted by political parties. He revealed that 86 cases of paid news had come to the notice of the commission during the last elections.

“In all these 86 cases, political parties and candidates had confessed that they had gone for paid news. Subsequently, they had agreed to include that in their expenses account,” he said.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby ramana » 12 Jan 2011 21:54

What about the Press Council of India sanctions on the erring news outlets?

Also if EC wants to modify the EVMS then the case against VHK and co should be dropped as it loses the legitimacy.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby AjayKK » 13 Jan 2011 12:01

As per the Representation of People’s Act 1951, Sec. 10 A

10A. Disqualification for failure to lodge account of election expenses.

If the Election Commission is satisfied that a person-

(a) has failed to lodge an account of election expenses within the time and in the manner required by or under this Act and (b) has no good reason or justification for the failure, the Election Commission shall, by order published in the Official Gazette, declare him to be disqualified and any such person shall be disqualified for a period of three years from the date of the order.

http://www.indiankanoon.org/doc/793501/



The EC is acting like the patriarch of a large family ( in this case 86 members ), who on discovering that so many family members are on the wrong side of the Act, decides to pull their cheeks and say "Ok Baba, mistake ho gaya, don't repeat". If a PIL is filed and the total of submitted expenses plus paid news expenses add up to more than Rs. 10 lakhs, then the MPs are liable for a 3 year disqualification.

And there are no updates from VHK Prasad as well..

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby sum » 25 Mar 2011 08:54

EVM a ‘laughter machine’ in RS

If failure of the electronic voting system in Rajya Sabha on Thursday caused embarrassment to Prime Minister Manmohan Singh and Deputy Chairman K Rahaman Khan, it brought amusement to the rest of the members in the House.

A technical snag in a voting machine occurred during the passage of the Constitution (113th) Amendment Bill concerning renaming Orissa as Odisha.

The electronic voting machine recorded the prime minister's vote inthe "Noes" category when he had actually voted in favour of the Bill. The members burst into laughter when Khan clarified that there was a defect in the system and asked the prime minister to use a paper slip to record his vote.

The problem persisted as various clauses of the Bill were put to division and Khan asked Singh not to press button and instead use the slip.

Amidst laughter, a BJP member asked Home Minister P Chidambaram, “Sir if this is the situation in the Rajya Sabha, what will be the situation in villages where the common man uses the electronic voting machine during elections?” However, the home minister did not respond.

Even as all the 169 members cast their votes in support of the Bill, the screen read only 147 votes.

The votes that were not recorded by the system included those of Communist Party of India-Marxist leaders Sitaram Yechury and Brinda Karat.

Not sure it is a laughing matter...

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby chaanakya » 25 Mar 2011 18:39

AjayKK wrote:As per the Representation of People’s Act 1951, Sec. 10 A

10A. Disqualification for failure to lodge account of election expenses.

If the Election Commission is satisfied that a person-

(a) has failed to lodge an account of election expenses within the time and in the manner required by or under this Act and (b) has no good reason or justification for the failure, the Election Commission shall, by order published in the Official Gazette, declare him to be disqualified and any such person shall be disqualified for a period of three years from the date of the order.

http://www.indiankanoon.org/doc/793501/



The EC is acting like the patriarch of a large family ( in this case 86 members ), who on discovering that so many family members are on the wrong side of the Act, decides to pull their cheeks and say "Ok Baba, mistake ho gaya, don't repeat". If a PIL is filed and the total of submitted expenses plus paid news expenses add up to more than Rs. 10 lakhs, then the MPs are liable for a 3 year disqualification.

And there are no updates from VHK Prasad as well..


Someone like Sheshan can only take this step.And sure courts would be stepping in to restrain.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Vipul » 16 Jun 2011 01:47

Indian Voting Machines With Paper Trails to Be Field-tested.

India's Election Commission plans to test in July new electronic voting machines (EVMs) that will offer a voter a verifiable paper trail, following criticism from political parties and activists that the machines could be tampered with.

But it is unclear whether the paper records of the vote will be discarded or saved after the voter has checked if his vote has been properly recorded. Some local newspaper reports in April said that the paper records would be destroyed after the voter had checked his vote.

The paper records should be saved and used in a recount or if any other dispute arises, said Hari Prasad, the security researcher who along with other researchers released a video last year that they said demonstrated vulnerabilities in the EVMs.

Prasad said that a Commission official had promised that the paper records would be stored for a specific period.

Election Commission officials were not immediately available for comment.

The Commission said in April that a technical expert committee on EVMs met with representatives of the two government-run companies that make the EVMs, to discuss the issues related to the introduction of a paper trail for the voting machines.

The machines with "voter-verifiable paper audit trail" will now be tested in election-like conditions, it said on Tuesday. The simulated elections will be held in five states of the country.

The Commission has decided to request national and state parties to get involved in the trial process, and also witness the trial to have a firsthand experience of the system, it said.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby UBanerjee » 16 Jun 2011 08:59

Rahul Mehta wrote:
Muppalla wrote:I don't go into CIA etc

Ok. But if CIA didnt rig EVMs, then it proves no one did. Because no one except CIA (CIA = CIA + MNCs + Christianists + USG) has strength to ensure that TV channels wont show 10 minute video on how EVMs can be rigged with ease. Try to answer - who suppressed this video from coming on TV channels?

Where exactly is this iron-clad logic coming from?

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Vipul » 23 Jun 2011 00:28

Election Commission tests a paper trail for electronic voting.

The Election Commission of India (EC) on Tuesday has readied a pilot to establish a paper trail for the electronic voting machine (EVM).

The pilot, to be launched in July, if successful would provide for a paper back up for every vote cast on the EVM and thereby address the growing criticism from some quarters that the technology is not tamper-proof.

EC plans to hold field trials of the voter verifiable paper audit trail (VVPAT) prototypes, made by Bharat Electronics Ltd and Electronics Corp. of India Ltd, next month across 35 polling stations in five locations that have been chosen to represent extreme environmental conditions.

“It is a verifiability test... At the end of it, we will be able to do an analysis to see how the VVPAT performed and based on that, a decision would be taken,” said deputy election commissioner Alok Shukla.

While it would make EVM use safer, it would raise the costs of conducting elections. Officials declined to provide any estimate; at present, each EVM costs just under Rs. 10,000.

EVMs have been at the centre of a controversy with activists and several political parties, including the Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP), the Communist Party of India (Marxist), or CPM, as well as regional parties, alleging that they are not tamper-proof.

EVMs were used for the first time in 45 seats in the 1999 general election. Polling in the 2004 elections was entirely through EVMs. In 2009, 671 million voted through EVMs.

The EVM-VVPAT system consists of an interface which connects an EVM to a printer which has a list of candidate details corresponding with the EVM.

Under the VVPAT system, when the voter presses the button for the candidate of his choice in the EVM, a paper ballot with the serial number, name and symbol of the candidate will be printed.

For the field trial, two kinds of printers will be used. In one system, the printer will be completely sealed and inaccessible to the voter with a transparent window in the front. Once the vote is caste, the printed ballot will remain in front of the transparent window for five seconds for the voter to verify it, after which it will automatically fall into a sealed box.

In the other system, there would be an open printer and the voter will get a thermal print out of the ballot, which he would then have to drop in a sealed ballot box before leaving the polling station.

For the trials, paper ballots from the printers will also be counted and cross-checked with votes recorded in the EVM.

G.V.L. Narasimha Rao, psephologist and a critic of EVMs, says VVPAT is a “compromise solution”. “The present situation has arisen because of the non-transparent nature of the voting process where nobody knows what happens inside that box and it is not open to scrutiny... However, whether the present solution works on the field remains to be seen. EC might have to innovate and improvise further.”

In order to make the process more inclusive, the commission has asked all recognized national and state parties to participate in the field tests by sending their representatives and polling agents. “We will also have a voter feedback form to get suggestions from voters as well as know if they have faced any difficulty,” Shukla said.

The commission had signalled a rethink of its stand on EVMs in October last year when it agreed to consider the feasibility of a paper-vote trail of every ballot registered during polling. This was after the opposition BJP sought a paper trail in the meeting between political parties and EC on 4 October.

EC had till then held that EVMs were foolproof and don’t quite require any paper-based confirmation. EC then referred the matter to a technical committee headed by P.V. Indiresan, former director of the Indian Institute of Technology (IIT), Chennai. The committee had recommended field testing of the prototypes.

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Re: Should we discontinue EVMs?

Postby Pranav » 24 Jun 2011 08:27

Vipul wrote:Under the VVPAT system, when the voter presses the button for the candidate of his choice in the EVM, a paper ballot with the serial number, name and symbol of the candidate will be printed.

For the field trial, two kinds of printers will be used. In one system, the printer will be completely sealed and inaccessible to the voter with a transparent window in the front. Once the vote is caste, the printed ballot will remain in front of the transparent window for five seconds for the voter to verify it, after which it will automatically fall into a sealed box.

In the other system, there would be an open printer and the voter will get a thermal print out of the ballot, which he would then have to drop in a sealed ballot box before leaving the polling station.

For the trials, paper ballots from the printers will also be counted and cross-checked with votes recorded in the EVM.


It is necessary that the ballot box remain in full public view at all times, and that there be no possibility of extra receipts being printed and dropped in.

The first model fails on both these counts, and it can be subverted by a Trojan. The second model is much better.


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