I am a member of the Saudi Arabian – Indian Business Council, and Saudi – Indian cooperation is something that can be seen in a number of fields. There can be no better evidence of this than Saudi Arabia accepting the role of mediator in the thorny issue of Kashmir between Pakistan and India.
I think TSP offered it to KSA. KSA accepted. Multiple sources are rreporting that KSA will play mediator over kashmir. I have a slight feeling that India may have said ok.sum wrote:I am a member of the Saudi Arabian – Indian Business Council, and Saudi – Indian cooperation is something that can be seen in a number of fields. There can be no better evidence of this than Saudi Arabia accepting the role of mediator in the thorny issue of Kashmir between Pakistan and India.
What is the great pride in accepting a role which has never been offered?
If that is the case, why shouldn't anyone wonder whether MMS is a sellout PM?I think TSP offered it to KSA. KSA accepted. Multiple sources are rreporting that KSA will play mediator over kashmir. I have a slight feeling that India may have said ok.
What do you mean?chetak wrote:Carl_T wrote:I don't see much discussion of Indian relations with Iraq. I think similar to Saudi Arabia, it's in our best interest to have a presence in Iraq ASAP. In the future, I think a strong democratic Iraq, with its wealth would be a good partner to have in WA. We are the second biggest destination of their oil as it is. Also a possible destination for Indian arms for their rebuilding military.
Strike a balance between the shia and the sunni, as it were.
More from Prince Sultans mouthpiece.So the collapse of the USSR in 1991 ought to have opened the door to Indo-Saudi cooperation, and indeed, a successful visit took place in 2001 with India's External Affairs Minister Jaswant Singh visiting Riyadh. But the events of 9/11 later that year, and the subsequent invasion in 2003 of Iraq, understandably took Saudi attention from India.
However, things have started to change. In 2006, King Abdullah was made the guest of honour at India's annual Republic Day Parade, and the Saudi entourage returned in a positive mood over the country that their close ally Pakistan loved to hate. Corporations in both countries began partnering with each other, and Riyadh began to pull back on its high-decibel backing for the Kashmiri separatists seeking to delink their state from India. That India was, together with China, the fastest-growing market for petroleum of course did not hurt.
After a BJP-led majority government was voted into office in 1999, military relations between the US and India deepened, and these days, there’s substantial joint activity between all three services. On April 23, the 10-day annual series of Malabar naval war games will start off the western coast of India, involving four US warships and a submarine, and with US Chief of Naval Operations Admiral Gary Roughead in attendance. The growing strategic closeness between India and the US has encouraged Saudi Arabia to follow suit, given that the country still relies on Washington for protection from threats such as from Iran.
However, the core of the newfound Indo-Saudi warmth is not military but economic, and is based on India becoming a significant market for Saudi oil, gradually shifting Delhi's dependence on Iran. From India, the Saudis are looking at education service providers. Seventy percent of Saudi Arabia's population is under 25, and it’s proving too expensive to rely exclusively on Western institutions for their training.
Although Saudi Arabia still bans the cinema, the efforts of religious hotheads to outlaw TV have not succeeded. Most homes have access to cable, so they can tune in to Bollywood soaps or watch the latest Shahrukh Khan movie on DVDs. After six decades of distance, the Saudis are once more in the process of re-discovering the many cultural links that they have with India.
U.S. considered oil invasion in 1973, Britain saysSaudi-Indian relations are nothing new as they have been strong for many decades. However today this relationship has taken on another dimension and is more vital. In 2006, Custodian of the Two Holy Mosques King Abdullah Bin Abdulaziz visited India as a guest on Indian Republic Day and the King and his country received a warm welcome.
A month ago, the Indian Prime Minister [Manmohan Singh] visited the Saudi capital and this visit saw the inception of what was called the ‘Riyadh Declaration’ which led to the strengthening of Saudi-Indian ties and took the relationship to another level. Today, we see Prince Salman Bin Abdulaziz visiting India and the hospitable welcome he received from India on all levels; political, economic, and educational.
The importance of Prince Salman Bin Abdulaziz’s visit to India lies in the fact that it comes within an ongoing framework to activate and strengthen Saudi-Indian relations. It is also important because it shows the seriousness of Saudi interaction with India. The other matter which is equally important is strengthening communication with India in all areas. This is for the sake of strengthening ties, as mentioned above, and in order to establish communication on the ground for citizens and businessmen, whereby there is activation of visa issues, economic sector activity is facilitated, and there is security cooperation between the two countries etc.
India has important international status, scientifically, economically and politically, and it is also a nuclear power. Saudi Arabia also has an important status as well, in terms of religion, politics, economics and more. Therefore, it is important that there is an effective relationship between Saudi Arabia and India that is firstly of benefit to the two countries and secondly of international benefit, politically and economically.
Some might think that the focus on the communication process is simplification but that is not true. A journalist from an Indian newspaper in New Delhi told me a story on Monday and it deserves to be retold to highlight the importance of communication. On the sidelines of a meeting arranged by the Saudi Ambassador to India, Faisal Bin al Trad, for myself and the Editor-in-Chief of Al Riyadh newspaper, Mr. Turki al Sudairi, to meet with some Indian journalists, a journalist told me that what significantly improved the image of Saudis in India recently was a story that has no relation whatsoever to the Riyadh Declaration or the projects that are due to be carried out or the excellent way in which the Indian Prime Minister was received last month in Riyadh. The story in fact was a very simple one.
The journalist told me that when the Indian Prime Minister visited Riyadh, New Delhi asked the Saudis a simple question: would the wife of the prime minister have to wear an Abaya or not? The answer from Riyadh was: that is up to you!
The Indian journalist said that this story touched the Indian media and even those who were not keen on consolidating Indian-Saudi ties. It sent a message to Indian society that the image of Saudi Arabia is not what some people make it out to be.
This story shows the importance of communication and getting to know societies closely instead of giving precedence to the prevailing stereotype. Every society has its own particularities that must be respected. There is no harm in the Indian woman being proud of the Sari that she wears and the Saudi woman being proud of the Abaya that she wears. But what’s most important is that we respect the traits of each society so that others respect our traits and our traditions.
From here, [it is evident that] communication is most important and if Prince Salman Bin Abdulaziz’s visit to India is solely for the sake of communication, that would be more than enough.
British spy chiefs warned after the 1973 Arab-Israeli war that they believed the United States might invade Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and Abu Dhabi to seize their oil fields, according to records released Thursday.
A British intelligence committee report from December, 1973, said the United States was so angry over Arab nations' earlier decision to cut oil production and impose an embargo on the United States that seizing oil-producing areas in the region was “the possibility uppermost in American thinking.”
Details of the Joint Intelligence Committee report were released under rules requiring that some secret documents be made public after 30 years. The report suggested that Richard Nixon might have risked such a drastic move if Arab-Israeli fighting had reignited and the oil-producing nations imposed new restrictions.
The 1973 embargo and production cuts, used by oil-rich Arab nations as a means to put pressure on the United States and Western Europe, caused a major global energy crisis and sent oil prices skyrocketing.
The committee of intelligence service directors calculated that the United States could guarantee sufficient oil supplies for themselves and their allies by taking oil fields in Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and Abu Dhabi, with total reserves of more than 28 billion tonnes.
It warned however that the U.S. occupation would need to last 10 years, as western nations developed alternative energy sources, and would lead to the “total alienation” of Arab states and many developing countries, as well as “domestic dissension” in the United States.
Other records released Thursday showed that prime minister Edward Heath was furious at president Richard Nixon over the U.S. president's failure to tell him he was putting U.S. forces on a worldwide alert during the 1973 Arab-Israeli war.
Mr. Heath learned of the alert — considered a high point in Cold War tensions — from news reports while he waited in the House of Commons for foreign secretary Alec Douglas-Home to make a statement on the Middle East crisis,
Britain's intelligence listening post, Government Communications Headquarters, had learned of the alert but did not tell Mr. Heath's office or the Foreign Office because officials assumed Mr. Heath and Mr. Douglas-Home already knew about it, the papers showed.
Mr. Nixon said he put U.S. troops on high alert for just under a week, starting on Oct. 25, 1973, to show the Soviet Union that the United States would not allow it to send military forces to aid Arab states fighting Israel.
The alert covered U.S. forces stationed in Britain, and Mr. Heath wrote in a memo that he thought Mr. Nixon's move, which came in the midst of the Watergate scandal, had been deeply damaging.
“Personally I fail to see how any initiative, threatened or real, by the Soviet leadership required such a world wide nuclear alert,” the prime minister wrote. “We have to face the fact that the American action has done immense harm, I believe, both in this country and worldwide.”
There is no harm in the Indian woman being proud of the Sari that she wears and the Saudi woman being proud of the Abaya that she wears. But what’s most important is that we respect the traits of each society so that others respect our traits and our traditions.
It was just a phrase at the end of President Obama’s news conference on Tuesday, but it was a stark reminder of a far-reaching shift in how the United States views the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, and how aggressively it might push for a peace agreement.
When Mr. Obama declared that resolving the long-running Middle East dispute was a “vital national security interest of the United States,” he was highlighting a change that has resulted from a lengthy debate among his top officials over how best to balance support for Israel against other American interests.
.Jyoti Malhotra / New Delhi April 17, 2010, 0:32 IST
It is being dubbed the rediscovery of India by the all-powerful House of Saud and its latest protagonist, Prince Salman bin Abdul Aziz al Saud, governor of Riyadh and third in line to the throne, has over the last five days in Delhi, Agra and Mumbai reaffirmed the message that terrorism in the name of Islam is not Islamic and that the entire region must be united against jehad.
As the guest of Vice-President Hamid Ansari, a former ambassador to Saudi Arabia and an Arabist of some repute himself, the red carpet has been pulled out for the Saudi prince, his five sons and a large retinue of businessmen and advisors, across the Indian landscape.
With Prime Minister Manmohan Singh away in the US and subsequently in Brazil all week for summit meetings with the heads of state of Brazil, South Africa, Russia and China, External Affairs Minister S M Krishna has led the political charge with Prince Salman. President Pratibha Patil feted him as did the Jamia Millia University in the capital, where he was awarded an honorary degree.
But, it is the eye-popping nature of the strategic partnership, launched by King Abdullah himself during his visit in 2006 and reaffirmed by the PM during his visit to Saudi Arabia a couple of months ago, that sets this relationship apart from Delhi’s every other foreign policy experiment in recent years.
By proposing a regular and upgraded partnership between the two foreign ministries, the intelligence communities as well as between the two National Security Advisers, Delhi and Riyadh are giving teeth to the two declarations signed in these two cities in 2006 and 2010, respectively.
Alongside this revamped political and strategic partnership, India and Saudi Arabia are pushing both their business communities to take advantage of mutually changing perceptions, and invest in areas like infrastructure, energy, industry and services. Prince Salman’s encounters with the chambers of commerce in Delhi as well as with key businessmen in Mumbai is in keeping with the belief that trade and investment will lubricate the wheels of politics.
According to Talmiz Ahmad, India’s ambassador to Saudi Arabia, who has been in the forefront of the partnership revamp, both countries are readying themselves to take the relationship “to the next level”.
Saudi Arabia’s ambassador to India Faisal Hassan Trad told Business Standard, that “sky is the limit in the India-Saudi relationship and it is not limited to the energy sector”.
So far, Ahmad explained, 1.8 million Indians, mostly from the blue-collar working class, sent back as much as $5 billion home in annual remittances. Meanwhile, the government procured about 20 per cent of its petroleum needs from the Saudi kingdom.
But in the “new strategic era” between India and Saudi Arabia, Delhi is hoping that big business will transform the economic landscape, from information technology to energy. “Let me put it like this,” said Ahmad, “from the use of Indians to the use of India, that’s the nature of the change. It goes much beyond the buying and selling of oil”.
Officials from both sides admitted that one big reason for the shift in Saudi Arabia’s perception of India was due to the way the world changed after the September 11, 2001 incidents. From being one of only three countries in the world that had recognised the Taliban in Afghanistan (the other two were Pakistan and the UAE), the shock that accompanied the fact that 15 of the 19 hijackers on September 11 were Saudi nationals, Riyadh’s internal overhaul could not avoid the conclusion that the rampant mix of religion and terror was actually a deadly cocktail.
“We were deeply affected by terrorism and we learnt how to deal with it,” Trad admitted.
Pakistan’s unique relationship with the Saudi kingdom, meanwhile, had been underlined by the belief that “Pakistan and the Pakistan army was a source of stability in the region. But Islamabad’s continuing demands for ‘strategic depth’ in Afghanistan as well as the “moral and diplomatic support” it gave to the Kashmir jehadis, also did not escape Riyadh’s notice.
In contrast, India was a large, Muslim nation(my comment: he means a nation with a large muslim population), but mostly a benign one. Meanwhile, the situation in Afghanistan began to rapidly deteriorate. That’s when Delhi began to convey its own message to Riyadh that the Pakistan army was really part of the problem, not the solution, said an Indian official on condition of anonymity.
As the custodian of the two holy mosques in Mecca and Medina, to which 1.6 billion Muslims all over the world looked for guidance and support, King Abdullah’s Saudi Arabia embarked upon “a very, very major U-turn” when it began to recognise that India, because of the nature of its open, democratic spirit, actually played a major role in the security and stability of the region, the Indian official added. (my comment: Basically, I think this is Talmiz Ahmad speaking. A well connected chap in West Asia quarters)
Prime Minister Manmohan Singh’s visit to Riyadh in February and the follow-up visit of Prince Salman to India, the official said, are manifestations of this new partnership.
Asked whether Saudi Arabia was interested in brokering a solution to the Kashmir dispute, as had been widely reported in the media during the PM’s visit to Riyadh, Trad did not give a direct answer. Instead, he said, “We fully understand India’s sensitivities and concerns. We also know that progress is not possible without peace,” Trad added.
Indian officials, even as they publicly rejected all suggestions of third-party interference to the Kashmir dispute, seem much more accepting in private of Saudi Arabia’s enormous influence with Islamabad. “As a good friend of Pakistan, Riyadh can persuade Pakistan to see reason. That would make a huge difference,” the officials said
) as well as training of Saudi armed forces personnel in India and exercises between the two armed forces. This could eventually, if all the stars are aligned correctly, build up into something significant in the years ahead. --------------------------About 4,000 Indians who overstayed in Oman have left the country after they were given outpasses, the Indian envoy here has said.
Indian Ambassador to Sultanate of Oman Anil Wadhwa told IANS: "We are making all efforts to speed up the process of repatriation of overstayers with the Omani ministry of manpower."
He said there were about 25,000 Indians who are supposed to leave by May 31, a deadline set for the illegal workers.
"Some 21,000 have already been registered with the embassy which has also finished the process of collecting fingerprints of 15,000 people. This is an important part of the process of the repatriation."
There are around 600,000 Indians who have been working and residing in Oman for the past three decades or so.
In order to maintain law and order, the Omani authorities periodicall declare amnesty for the illegal workers to leave the country. But they do their work humanely.
Sathish Nambair, president of the Malayali Association for the past 16 years, said the Omani authorities have been very helpful and friendly towards Indians.
"Part of the credit goes to His Majesty Sultan Qaboos who maintains very cordial relations with India," said Nambair.
Vasudevan, a doctor speaking from Nizwa, 160 km from here, said: "In Oman we feel a home outside our home. If you feel a bit homesick you can take a flight back to your state for a few days or weeks, recharge your emotional batteries and feel fresh again to do your work or business in Oman."
----------------------------------The Israeli organizations never examined the backgrounds of the Italians who assisted them. In 1938, members of the Betar movement participated in a naval training course in Benito Mussolini's fascist Italy. Mossad L'Aliya Bet and the prestate military organizations Palmach and Palyam - which worked to bring Jews to Israel, purchase arms and blow up ships and planes carrying weapons to Arab countries - were assisted by former fascists. A key Italian figure was Pino Romualdi, leader of the neofascist Movimento Sociale Italiano, with which the current speaker of the Italian parliament, Gianfranco Fini, was also affiliated. Romualdi supplied the Irgun, another prestate underground, with explosives from old cartridges used by the fascists in World War II. Another fascist who was very close to Mussolini, Fiorenzo Capriatti, came to Israel and helped create Shayetet 13, the navy commando unit. According to Salerno, the Mossad persuaded Italy's current prime minister, Silvio Berlusconi, and his aides to order Italy's intelligence services to give it the names of their own operations officers, so that Mossad could obtain their help in its clandestine operations. Adm. Flavio Martini, a former head of SISMI, said that when he was SISMI's chief of operations in the 1970s, he traveled to Syria, and upon his return, provided Israeli intelligence with Damascus' plans for war.....
----------------By ROBERT MACKEY
Palestinians in the West Bank town of Hawara awoke on Wednesday to find a blue star of David painted on the outside of their mosque, after what a local resident described as an attack by Israeli settlers who live nearby.
According to the Israeli newspaper Haaretz, the vandals also uprooted more than 300 olive trees, set two cars on fire and painted the name of the prophet Muhammad, in Hebrew letters, on a wall of the mosque.
Ynet News, another Israeli newspaper site, reported:
Hawara resident Ziad Dib told Ynet that he saw a number of settlers flee the village in a Subaru at around 3 a.m. According to him, the settlers torched his car.
Haaretz noted that Israeli officials said the vandalism may be part of a wider campaign by settlers:
A military official told Army Radio that the army suspected settler violence against Palestinians, part of some settlers’ policy of imposing a ‘price tag’ on a government order to freeze Israeli construction in the West Bank. As part of the strategy, settlers from nearby Yitzhar have launched numerous attacks on Palestinians, including an arson attack on a mosque in December 2009.
That arson attack on a West Bank mosque in December also featured graffiti written in Hebrew — including the threat, “We will burn all of you.” The earlier attack was condemned by Israeli officials, and Israel’s the chief Ashkenazi rabbi, Yona Metzger, compared it to Kristallnacht, the November 1938 attacks on Jewish synagogues and businesses in Nazi Germany.
West Bank mapThe New York Times
Kamal Odeh, a Hawara resident who represents of the ruling Fatah party, told Reuters that the attack was the second on the village this week. He said that settlers has set another car on fire and shot at a shop on Monday. “The situation is very tense,” he said. “There is real anger.”
Itamar Ben-Gvir, a settler who is a leader of a movement that encourages young Israelis to expand settlements by seizing hilltops in the occupied West Bank, told Haaretz that Hawara was “a hostile village that has been the source of a large number of violent attacks against the residents of Yitzhar.” The newspaper reported that in recent weeks, “Two settlers were wounded when stones were thrown at them, one suffering permanent neurological damage.”
-------------------------------For nearly 30 years, JINSA has been taking recently retired American Admirals and Generals to Israel to better understand the threats Israel faces, the resources it brings to its own defense and ways in which the U.S. and Israel can cooperate on common security issues. Their understanding of the role of Israel is in the ad below. JINSA is working to place the ad in newspapers (Jewish and other) around the country to ensure that Americans (Jewish and other) hear these voices. You can help spread the word by making a contribution to JINSA - clicking below.
We, the undersigned, have traveled to Israel over the years with The Jewish Institute for National Security Affairs (JINSA). We brought with us our decades of military experience and, following unrestricted access to Israel's civilian and military leaders, came away with the unswerving belief that the security of the State of Israel is a matter of great importance to the United States and its policy in the Middle East and Eastern Mediterranean. A strong, secure Israel is an asset upon which American military planners and political leaders can rely. Israel is a democracy - a rare and precious commodity in the region - and Israel shares our commitment to freedom, personal liberty and rule of law.
Its already been done with the silly people advising MMS to vote against Eyeran on the nuclear issue when its of no concern or consequence to India.Anujan wrote:Also the desire to cleave India from her relationship with Iran cannot be ruled out.
I really dont know. I think the Saudis's have invested in the Pakistani nuclear program and want a payback there. Its also another thing to run anti piracy patrols. But the growing extremism in the Pakistani Army from 2003 when the accord with the Saudis was signed to the present time IMO will make the Saudi's wonder whether they want 80,000 Pakistani troops (with questionable loyalty) on their soil now or in the future. 80,000 Pakistani troops plus Pakistani nuclear weapons in KSA? The House of Saud will start to play second fiddle to Kiyanishyamd wrote:Quick replies. Anujan - Spot on.
lDevji, I disagree about TSPA extremists linking up with KSA guys. TSP is very much still present in KSA (Confirmation from multiple sources). TSPN is doing anti piracy duties on behalf of KSA is what I hear. TSPA is still very much present in KSA in 3 bases I believe. You can read more about the agreement here
So, did a bit more research.By p00103740 on Wed, 18/04/2007 - 7:10pm
Brahmins Fought for Imam Hussain in the Battle of Karbala
by Rakesh Sharma on Apr 18, 2007 09:23 PM | Hide replies
Hindus have a long association with Iraq and Muslims. Please read the article below:
The presence in Arabia of many Hindus. mostly Brahmins. before the rise of Islam, has been recorded by the historian Sisir Kumar Mitra, in his book 'The Vision of India'. page 183. These people observed Hindu religious customs, including the worship of Shiva and Makresha from which the name of Mecca is said to have been derived. The famous astrologer Yavanacharya was born of one such Brahmin family. It was from these Brahmins that the Arabs learnt the science of Mathematics, Astrology, Algebra and decimal notation which were first developed in India.
At the time of the war of Karbala (Oct. 680 AD). Rahab Sidh Datt, a potentate of Datt sect, was a highly esteemed figure of Arabia due to his close relations with the family of Prophet Mohammed. In the holy war when no Muslim King came to help Hussain. Rahab fought On his side mld sacrificed his seven sons (named Sahas Rai. Haras Rai, Sher Khan, Rai Pun, Ram Singh, Dharoo and Poroo) in the bloody war.
A Brief Account of the Episode: After the death of Mohammed, he was succeeded by Abu Bakr, Omar and Osman, as the Caliphs: all three were related to him by marriage alliances. Osman was not popular and was assassinated. After his death, Hazrat AlL the son-in-law of Mohammed (he was also his first cousin) who was married to the Prophet's third daughter and the only surviving issue, Bibi Fatima Zahira, became the 4th Caliph. There was stiff opposition to Ali's rule from Amir Moavia, a known protege of Osman. He fought with him a bitter war for 5 years and finally got him murdered in a mosque of Koofa, his mausoleum with a golden dome, stands in the nearby town of Najaf (Iraq). After the extermination of Ali, Moavia grabbed the Caliphate and converted the Islamic state into a kingdom, After his death, his notorious son Yazid became the next ruler. However, the rightful claimants of the Caliphate were the descendants of Hazrat Ali, namely, Hassan and Hussain. While Hassan abdicated his claim to the crown and later died of suspected poisoning, his younger brother Imam Hussain who was till then leading a secluded life in Medina, came out and challenged the usurper, Yazid. It was the war of attrition between the two which led to the bloodshed of Karbala (102 km south of Baghdad), on Oct. 10, 680 AD.
The participation of the Mohyals Brahmins and more precisely that of a Dutt family living in Arabia at that time, in the holy war, is a fact of the history. They were a part of the entourage of 200 men and women, including 72 members of Hussain's family (40 on foot and 32 on horseback), when he left Medina and made an arduous trek to Karbala, where he had a large friendly following. After 18 days, i.e. on the 2nd. day of Mohurrum, the Hussain's caravan reached Karbala, on the bank of river Euphrates and surrounded by a hostile desert. On the 7th day of Mohurrum, all hell broke out when 30,000 strong army sent by Yazid from Mecca and other places, attacked them. 6,000 soldiers guarded the river bank to ensure that not a drop of water reached the Hussain's thirsty innocents. By sunset of 10th (Ashoor), a Friday, all were dead including his step brother Abbas (32), his son Ali Akbar (22), daughter Skeena (4) and 6 months old infant Ali Asghar who was killed by an arrow while perched in his lap. Imam Hussain himself was slain with thirty three strokes of lances and swords by Shimr, the hatchet man of ignominious Yazid. The ruffians of Yazid, as they ran carrying the smitten head of Hussain to the castle of Koofa, were chased by Rahab. He retrieved the holy man's head, washed it reverentially and then carried it to Damascus. According to legend, he was overtaken by Yazid's men during his ovenight shelter on the way. They demanded Hussain's head from him: Rahab executed the head of one of his sons and offered to them. They shouted that it was not the Hussain's head, then he beheaded his second son and they again yelled that it was not his. In this way Rahab executed the heads of his seven sons but did not part with the head of Imam Hussain. Later, after one year, it was buried in Karbala along with rest of his body.
The intrepid Datts rallied round Amir Mukhtar, the chief of the partisans of Imam Hussain, fought with extraordinary heroism and captured and razed the fort of Koofa, seat of Yazid's governor, Obaidullah, the Butcher. After scoring a resounding victory on the battlefield, they beat the drums and yelled out that they had avenged the innocent blood of Hussain shed at Karbala.
It is also significant to note that even before the Karbala incident, Hazrat Ali had entrusted the public exchequer to the regiment of the valiant Datts, at the time of the Battle of Camels fought near Basra.
The above provides an impeccable evidence about tha pragmatic role played by the Datt Mohyals in the catastrophe of Karbala. There are more than a dozen ballads composed centuries ago which vividly and with great passion describe the scenario of the historic event.
Interestingly, in the Preface of his famous historical novel, titled Karbala, published in 1924 from Lucknow, Munshi Prem Chand has stated that the Hindus who fought and sacrificed their lives in the holy war of Karbala, are believed to be the descendants of Ashvathama.This clearly establishes their link with the Datts who consider Ashvathama as an ancestor of their clan.
Later on, when Sunnis let loose an orgy of vendetta on Shias and Datts, Datts returned to their motherland around 700 AD and settled at Dina Nagar, District Sialkot (vide Bandobast Report of Gujarat by Mirza Azam Beg page 422 and folk songs) and some drifted to as far as the holy Pushkar in Rajasthan. Starting from Harya Bandar (modern Basra on the bank of river Tigris) with swords in hand and beating durms, they forced their way through Syria and Asia Minor and marching onwards captured Ghazni, Balkh and Bukhara. After annexing Kandhar, they converged on Sind and crossing the Sind at Attock they entered the Punjab.
An ancestor of Rahab named Sidh Viyog Datt assumed the title of Sultan and made Arabia (old name Iraq) his home. He was a tough and tenacious fighter. He was also known as Mir Sidhani. He was a worshipper of Brahma. He was the son of the stalwart Sidh Jhoja (Vaj) who was a savant and saint and lived in Arabia (Iraq) around 600 AD.
The supporters of Hassan and Hussain honoured the Datts with the htle of 'Hussaini Brahmin' and treated them with great reverence in grateful recognition of the supreme sacrifices made by them in the war of Karbala. According to Jang Nama, written by Ahmed Punjabi, pages 175-176, it was ordained on the Shias to recite the name of Rahab in their daily prayer. At the time to the Karbala, fourteen hundred Hussaini Brahmins lived in Baghdad alone
---------------------------Apart from figures in the Dharmic religions, there are many Brahmins in the religion of Islam, especially those western-Born Indian Brahmin converts to Islam.
The group known as "Hussaini Brahmins" are the disciples of Imam Hussian, grandson of the prophet Mohammad.
A popular saying about the Hussainis has it thus:
But there is also another version of how the Dutts of Punjab came to be known as Hussaini Brahmins. One of the wives of Imam Hussain, the Persian princess Shahr Banu, was the sister of Mehr Banu, the wife of an Indian king called Chandragupta. When it became clear that Yazid was adamant on wiping out the Imam, the Imam's son Ali ibn Hussain rushed off a letter to Chandragupta asking him for help against Yazid. When Chandragupta received the letter, he dispatched a large army to Iraq to assist the Imam. By the time they arrived, however, the Imam had been slain. In the town of Kufa, in present-day Iraq, they met with one Mukhtar Saqaffi, a disciple of the Imam, who arranged for them to stay in a special part of the town, which even today is known by the name of Dair-i-Hindiya or ‘the Indian quarter’.
Some Dutt Brahmins, under the leadership of one Bhurya Dutt, got together with Mukhtar Saqaffi to avenge the death of the Imam. They stayed behind in Kufa, while the rest returned to India. Here they built up a community of their own, calling themselves Hussaini Brahmins, and although they did not convert to Islam they kept alive the memory of their links with Imam Hussain.
The Hussaini Brahmins believe that Krishna had foretold the event of the Imam's death at Karbala in the Gita. According to them, the Kalanki Purana, the last of eighteen Puranas, as well as the Atharva Veda, the fourth Veda, refer to Imam Hussain as the divine incarnation or avatar of the Kali Yug, the present age. They hold Imam Ali, Imam Hussain's father, and son-in-law and cousin of the Prophet Muhammad, in particular reverence, refer-ring to him with the honorific title of Om Murti.
This group applies the tilak on their forehead just like many other Hindus.[45]
Confirmation that Omani's, Yemeni's wear the lungi - Dubai crown prince has been seen wearing it on fishing trips. Popular with UAE/GCC fishermen. Man, I swear I have seen them in Qatari pearl diving adverts.by Gabriel Vaz
Daijiworld Media Network
April 18, 2010
Can you imagine wearing Lungi, which is perhaps the undeclared official attire for men in Kerala – widely known as God’s Own Country – or the Mundu/Dhoti that enjoys similar status in Tamil Nadu and even Sri Lanka, being considered indecent?
Well, that is exactly what is happening in Sharjah, one of the seven among the United Arab Emirates (UAE) – barely an hour’s drive away from the internationally famous business and trade centre of Dubai in the Middle-East. Of course, men found wearing Lungis and strolling in the public (and not in their private homes) are being arrested by the Sharjah police.
It is quite surprising that the ubiquitous lungi, mundu, doti or its equivalent garments used mostly by men but also by women in some states and countries should be targeted as an indecent dress, when skimpy and revealing dresses are considered quite fashionable. Incidentally, the lungi and equivalent garments are being singled out after the ban on burkha by France and many other European countries.
Newspaper readers must have read reports and articles about Sharjah police launching a crackdown of men found wearing Lungis or its equivalent wraparound dress for men like Mundus and strolling in the public. Indians, particularly Malayalis and others as well as Tamilians from Tamil Nadu and Sri Lanka, who have been at the receiving end of the Sharjah police are understably quite peeved and incensed.
"Wear your lungi or mundu, if you like. But in your home and not in public,” is the message that comes out in Sharjah. The issue gained so much public attention that many newspapers in the Gulf as well as in India, including the financial daily, The Economic Times, did carry several news reports and articles on the issue.
Senior police officials of Sharjah, according to newspaper reports, contended that wearing indecent and revealing clothes in public is not allowed. They, however, have not explicitly stated whether wearing Lungis in public is banned. ``There is a decency law in place for over a decade in Sharjah and all people are expected to wear decent clothes in public,’’ is a police officer’s comment, which had been published in Gulf News.
But then, there is no official word as yet. However, male passengers flying on the Kozhikode-Sharjah flight are being privately advised that they better change into pants before disembarking in Sharjah.
The move has already caused consternation among Indians, mainly Malayalees, Tamilians and Telugus, who are fond of slipping into the most traditional and convenient lungi or mundu working in the Gulf countries as soon as they reach home after a day’s hard work. The lungi is plain white cloth is generally known as mundu, which sometimes comes with a colour or golden border.
While it is doubtful whether there can be any legal recourse, even if the Sharjah authorities come out with some sort of ban against the wearing of lungi or mundu, the online community and some newspapers in Kerala and Tamil Nadu have already started a low-key campaign trying to build pressure on union minister of state for external affairs Shashi Tharoor and union defence minister A K Antony as well as union home minister P Chidambaram and others who always were the traditional dress should do something even take up the issue with the Sharjah authorities through the UAE government as after all, what happens in one of the Gulf could conveniently be repeated in other parts as well.
Lungi is a piece of brightly coloured silk or cotton cloth that is wrapped and tried around the waist. It covers the knees and even is allowed to flow till the ankles. It is worn in India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Myanmar, Sri Lank, Indonesia, Malaysia, Indonesia and other South Asian countries but with different names. It is worn by men and/or women. In India too, apart from Kerala, Tamil Nadu or Andhra Pradesh, lungi or mundu or its equivalent garments are quite popular in Gujarat, Rajasthan, West Bengal and many other states.
They are tied or fastened in various ways and can be used in different cultural activities, ranging from normal daily life to elaborate wedding ceremonies. For daily purposes, a simple ``double twist knot’’ is most popular, where two points in the upper edge of lungi are brought together and twisted around twice, with the ends tucked in at the waist. However, it is also common for wearers to simply tie a double ``pretzel knot” from two points on the upper border, which produces a more secure knot. The lungi's length can also be adjusted, for example, by tucking in the lungi at the waist to make it resemble a short skirt.
Unlike dhotis or Sarong, which are linear like sheets, lungis are often sewn into a tube-like shape and worn like a skirt by men. The upper edge of the lungi are often tied at its upper edge and tied around the waist. In Mayanmar, lungi is called longyi in Burmese while in Somalia the garment is generally referred as a macawis and is commonly worn by Somali men as casual wear.
Incidentally, in Tamil Nadu, mundu or the equivalent of lungi is mostly worn in a different fashion than in Kerala. The garment is known as Kalli or Saaram/Chaaram in southern Tamil Nadu. It is generally tied at the right side, Tamilians tie it on the left. Even some Muslim communities in Kerala are known to wearing mundu on the right. In Yemen, the garment is known as Futah and is generally worn by men of all ages, it is known as Izaar in Oman.
There are cotton, batik or silk lungis, which are used as a convenient garment for daily usage or even fashionably worn on ceremonial occasions at home. In Kerala, Tamil Nadu, Andhra Pradesh or Sri Lanka, Mayanmar or Pakistan and Bangladesh men as well as women also wear the lungi or mundu indoors and sometimes even outdoors, while engaged in manual labour. It can be worn any time of the day and even while sleeping. In some places, people are known use the lungi or mundu as bedsheets while sleeping. Well, the lungi is really universal in appeal and convenience.
While men in most Western countries and even former colonies of British or French generally prefer pants and other western garments, lungis, mundus or other skirt-type of garments are quite popular in many Asian countries for work, play and formal as well as casual occasions. They have the advantage as being quite cool in hot climates and are considered convenient and non-constricting.
Of course, there are several jokes floating around about people wearing lungi, mundu or dhotis and equivalent garments. But then such jokes are quite common and normal and still popular among most Mangaloreans.
1 paki == 17 hindus+sikhsSeeking justice, 17 Indian youth on the death row in the United Arab Emirates (UAE) have alleged before human rights activists from India that they have been framed in the murder case of a Pakistani national after being tortured.
Representatives of a Punjab-based NGO, Lawyers For Human Rights International (LFHRI) who recently returned after meeting the 17 Indians sentenced to death in Sharjah, Tuesday alleged here that the youth were tortured and were not being given proper legal aid.
A two-member team of LFHRI had visited Dubai and Sharjah April 13-14 and met the prisoners and also held a meeting with lawyers who are fighting their case.
"We had a two-hour meeting with 17 Indians and we came across a very sorry state of affairs. The apathy of prisoners revealed a total miscarriage of justice," alleged LFHRI general secretary Navkiran Singh while talking to reporters here.
The 17 Indians, aged between 17 and 30 years, were sentenced to death by a court in Sharjah for killing a Pakistani man and injuring three others in January 2009 following a fight over illegal liquor business.
-------------------------Workers given false information by Indian agencies
Agencies promise workers a certain salary and sign different contract with employer
‘We do not want them to be subject to exploitation due to misunderstanding'
Washington: Amid reports of exploitation of Indian workers by unscrupulous agents and employers in Saudi Arabia, Riyadh on Thursday asked New Delhi to raise awareness among its workers about their rights and obligations before they arrive in Saudi Arabia for work.
“We urge India to raise the awareness of its workers before they leave the country for Saudi Arabia, to disseminate information to the workers about what are their obligations and rights,” Saudi Labour Minister Abdulwahed K Al-Humaid told PTI here.
He was in Washington to attend the first-ever meeting of the Labour and Employment Ministers of the G-20 countries. The two-day conference concluded on Wednesday.
He said some workers were exploited because they did not know their rights and also blamed Indian agencies that hired these people for being party to the exploitation.
“Before workers come to Saudi Arabia, they sign a contract with the Indian agencies. Agencies give them false information. They promise them a certain salary and sign a different contract with employer. So, some of the disputes arose because we have two contracts.”
“Whenever I meet Ambassadors from the workers' home country, I urge them to make their workers aware of their rights before they come to Saudi Arabia.”
He said that his Ministry prints brochures in local languages and request embassies in Saudi Arabia to distribute them among their people before they leave for Saudi Arabia.
“We do not want them to be subject to exploitation due to lack of information or misunderstanding. Because if I am an owner of a factory I sign a contract that the salary, for example, is 1,000 Riyal, but the Indian workers sign another contract with the Indian agency stating that the salary is 2,000 Riyal.”
“On one hand Indian workers are contributing to the economic development of Saudi Arabia and we appreciate that. On the other, we are offering job opportunities to two million Indian people. Therefore, we are benefiting the Indian economy and relieving the unemployment problem in India.” — PTI
So, the M2K sale with India issue is restarting again after previous rejection by IAF over cost?IOL says: Qatari and Abu Dhabi air force have proposed a sale of their respective Mirage2K fleet to India earlier this month, this is carefully coordinated with Dassault who will replace the Qatari/Emirati fleet with new Rafales.
The fast track acquisition can be made if deal get diectly negotiated by Congressi representative instead of MOD.shyamd wrote:Folks, I have learned today, that Oman has placed their first order of weapons from India.
M2K sale/upgrade is a never ending saga. Has been going on for years. Lets see if we get a good deal.