MRCA (Many Rakshaks Choose Aircraft) Contest - Episode III

[uddu]

Trump will not go to the extend of sanctioning engines at the moment if we are not in an escalatory fight. This will be affecting U.S defense exports and Defense lobby will get upset. We have not picked a fight with the U.S on Tariff's with counter Tariffs. As long as the burden is on U.S civilians to pay it and I don't think GOI is ever interested in a Tariff fight with the U.S. They will diversify or find new market place. Though have to be careful about the likes of loonies like Lindsay Graham chewing on Trumps ears getting their way.

It's always good to have a backup plan. But our govt only responds once that happens and Tejas is grounded then some Tender will appear for "Supply engines for Tejas".

They will not do a Kaveri testing just as an experimental project to guage its performance. They will not in the interim test other engines on the Tejas to offer the clients various options. Nothing. These things need capable leaders like Parikkar who knows technology and is also capable enough to give solutions and directions in resolving current and possible future problems.

[Bharadwaj]

In Rafale we trust and quite frankly no one can blame IAF for that. The Netra mk2 may also take its own time so maybe 4-5 Saab global eye for emergency purchase? Yes I know porki have erieye. The tejas mk1a and astra mk2/3 combo would also benefit from a longer range targeting link to deal with the j-20/j-35. Even the Chinese recently admitted that the j-20 was not safe from a j-10 that was keyed in by their awacs.

[Manish_P]

...
It's always good to have a backup plan. But our govt only responds once that happens and Tejas is grounded then some Tender will appear for "Supply engines for Tejas".
...

Aren't aircrafts designed around engines?

We can't ask for alternate engines if the original supplier stops.

At the IAF and GoI trusts France more than the US it would make sense to go with the French (or the Russians) for the tip of the spear AMCA.

[uddu]

...
It's always good to have a backup plan. But our govt only responds once that happens and Tejas is grounded then some Tender will appear for "Supply engines for Tejas".
...

Aren't aircrafts designed around engines?

We can't ask for alternate engines if the original supplier stops.

At the IAF and GoI trusts France more than the US it would make sense to go with the French (or the Russians) for the tip of the spear AMCA.

Just do know that Tejas was designed with Kaveri to be incorporated at a later stage. So they surely has that accommodated while designing the specs.
Google gives some details like this
Characteristic Kaveri (GTX-35VS) Eurojet EJ200 GE F404 (F404-GE-402) Snecma M88 Klimov RD-33
Length (cm) 349.0 398.78 391 353.8 422.9
Diameter (cm) 90.9 73.66 89 (overall), 71 (inlet) 69.6 73 (inlet), 104 (maximum)
Dry Weight (kg) 1180 988.83 1035 897 1055

Russian RD-33 is said to be longer to accommodate. There will be many other factors as well.

Even the HAL HLFT-42. Which engine will be used on that? Will Kaveri in its present form suffice or we have to choose between some Russian or French option.

[drnayar]

What is the case for such numbers of Rafales ?

A fighter that is powered by a non-US turbofan.

Using that line of thought, Rafale makes ample sense to Air HQ.

As such there is a case to find alternatives to GE for 404 and 414 Tejas engines, they should not be flying at somebody s whim at the whitehouse !

[Rakesh]

So AMCA is still going to be GE right...

No. 414 was always supposed to be just a temp engine.

The initial plan was to have two squadrons of AMCA Mk1 to be powered by GE F414 turbofans.

The latest plan is to have only the TD and PV aircraft to be powered by GE F414 turbofans.

The production ready AMCA airframes are planned to be fitted with an Indian turbofan.

[Manish_P]

The initial plan was to have two squadrons of AMCA Mk1 to be powered by GE F414 turbofans.

The latest plan is to have only the TD and PV aircraft to be powered by GE F414 turbofans.

The production ready AMCA airframes are planned to be fitted with an Indian turbofan.

So there is still some hope that plans can change even more and even the TD and PV birds might get a french or russian engine

More power to the carrot top and may his firmaans get even more outrageous...

[Rakesh]

Round & Round the Merry Go Round We Go!

IAF seeks 114 Rafale jets in direct deal with France, bypassing MRFA tender
https://www.aerotime.aero/articles/iaf- ... irect-deal
13 August 2025

The Indian Air Force (IAF) plans to submit the case for “Acceptance of Necessity” (AoN), an early but essential step in India’s defense procurement process, to the Defence Acquisition Council (DAC) by October 2025. A final government decision is expected thereafter.

[VKumar]

As I wrote earlier. One squadron of Rafale every year till AMCA is available.

Man after exploring all alternatives will chose what is logical.

[Rakesh]

Article is originally in French, so Google Chacha's translation into English is little off...but you will get the gist.

The Dassault Aviation Rafale announced that the mega-ga-Middle MRFA contract would be awarded in India
https://www.avionslegendaires.net/2025/ ... trat-mrfa/
13 August 2025

India's specialized defence and economic media have been on the same basis for 24 hours on the issue. All their sources announced a victory for the Dassault Aviation Rafale F4 under the MRFA programme to supply 114 combat aircraft. The last reluctance to assemble the fleet in India would therefore have been withdrawn by France. An official announcement is expected next month at the 80th United Nations General Assembly in New York. So forget the eighty examples ordered by the United Arab Emirates at the end of 2021, the Cloidal-ray aircraft manufacturer is preparing to strike much stronger. This is about a hundred and fourteen Rafale F4 fighter aircraft for the Indian Air Force. The Indians are seeking to speed up the contract through a G2G agreement, i.e. between governments. Emmanuel Macron and Narendra Modi would negotiate signatures themselves, speeding up proceedings.

The MRFA program, for Multi-Role Fighter Aircraft, provides for the replacement of Dassault Aviation Mirage 2000, Mikoyan MiG-29 Fulcrum, and SEPECAT Jaguar of Indian Air Force front-line units. Several international competitors were in the running, but between the total refusal of the F-35A Lightning II and the blacklisting of other American hunters, all of them accelerated very quickly in recent days. Russia believed it had to turn around by proposing a mixed contract Sukhoi Su-35 Flanker-E and Su-57 Felon without the Indians being seduced. Nothing to do with the favourite Dassault Aviation Rafale for 11 months. With the Indians, we must always be patient, even if the psychics have been green since last spring, and in particular the air operation (untwhat of Pakistan). The fact that an Indian single-seater Rafale hit by a Pakistani air-to-air missile (Chinese-in-chartiled) managed to return to good harbour and save the life of its pilot has finished convincing the Indian Air Force of its willingness to command a hundred Rafales.

Now it is now a question of a “made in India” construction oscillating between 75 and 80% of the examples ordered by the MRFA. The rest will be in France, at Dassault Aviation. The fact that the Rafale F4 is guaranteed ITAR free is a real plus for an India that is now clearly in a trade and economic war with the United States. India should become the Rafale’s major user in the world that many had hoped for in recent years. And all this in the nose and beard of American and Russian aircraft manufacturers who are far too sure of them on this program. Case (of course) to be followed.

[SRajesh]

https://www.news18.com/world/worlds-cos ... 35526.html
Another One Bites The Dust!!
Too Costly and tooo many issues
Hope we dont get F35ed!!

[drnayar]

https://www.news18.com/world/worlds-cos ... 35526.html
Another One Bites The Dust!!
Too Costly and tooo many issues
Hope we dont get F35ed!!

What if the Americans actually got the F35 to India for MRFA trials and ..it failed